I'm happy, but still nervous... Like, it should be fine, right? Nothing too horrible will happen between now and January 20th?

Oh it's likely to be hell until then, but we've had 4 years of practice.  And when the day comes, all we need to do is dangle something sparkly/young&female outside the white house gates then change the passcodes.  He'll be spending the time trying to pre-pardon himself and take as much as he can. The Bidens will probably have to bring their own lightbulbs.

Clodfobble wrote:

I'm happy, but still nervous... Like, it should be fine, right? Nothing too horrible will happen between now and January 20th?

Not heard were rumors of the Executive Order to target all top officials for all departments and government agencies?  To eliminate civil service protection so they can be fired in mass numbers.

And then if the next administration tries to restore civil service protection, Trump extremists cannot be fired.

He is not there to advance American.  As so often stated by Trump supporters, he is popular only because he "Wrecks Shit".   He has two months (plenty of time) to do that.

Why someone lying constantly is still popular with 70 million Americans demonstrates the power of brainwashing.  He is lying.  So he must be telling truths.
 

yeah just like the American people in 7 of the last 8 presidential elections
 

Big Sarge wrote:

Flint - I'm saying the votes still have not been tabulated, canvassed, and certified. That does not mean the "Republicans are lawless cheaters."   

Why is Trump constantly declaring he won?  Because he was a lawless cheater for over 40 years.  That is his entire adult history.  Somehow one associates Trump with Republicans?  Trump has subverted the Republican party.

Who were not invited to speak at the Republican Convention?  Every past Republican presidential candidate.  All who won and lost.  All previous Republican Speakers of the House.  Uninvited.  Why would anyone associate past Republican party leaders with the current corrupt one?  Classic brainwashing.  So extreme right wing as unable to even see a difference between a moderate and a liberal.

Trump lies every day.  He is held in contempt by the vast majority of patriotic Americans.  The moderates.  Apparently you are so far right wing extremist as to not even know what a moderate is.  An informed American does not view the world in black and white;, left or right..  Only children see this world in such extremes.

Why would anyone have a kind word for one who never pays his contractors.  Who steals properties even from his own family members.  Who is called corrupt and immoral even by his own sister (a Federal judge).  Who has never once run a profitable company.  Whose contempt of religion is masked by so many lies that religious people even believe he goes to church.  Who has defaulted on loans to every major American bank.  Who prevaricates his entire life.  Who cheated on every wife.  Then trades them in for a new one every ten years.  Whose family members are so shady that many could not even get security clearances.  Who has contempt for every American ally.  Directs most admiration for dictators including Xi, Kim, and Putin.  Has a 30 second attention span.  Has a personality disorder attached to an ego so massive as to not even admit he lost.  Makes decisions based only in what the last person told him.  Cannot even admit simplest truths.  So Big_Sarge loves him?

He is smarter than the generals.  He is smarter than the doctors.   He openly disparaged every subordinate as incompetent or unintelligent.  Since that gets the brainwashed to believe only Trump is a great man - in the tradition of Milosevic, Mussolini, Idi Amin, Castro, and Hugo Chavez. He knows bright lights on a chest or drinking bleach will cure a virus. He is despised by most every former member of his cabinet.  Universal expression is constantly, "he is unqualified for the job.".  He even claims an election was stolen by fraud.  Only an adult, who still thinks like a child, would respect such a man.   But that means one learns from history.  And not from their emotions.

This past week, every responsible news service - domestic and foreign - has been using the same expressions. "His charges are baseless."  "That is not true."  "He lied."  Such expressions never existed constantly with any other president even back the Eisenhower - except Nixon.  But this past week, those expressions have been attached to every Trump statement.  By every major western news service around the world - from Britain and Germany to Australia and Japan.

Trump lies constantly.  He never was an honest man. He even lied about birthing.  He has always been corrupt.  Corrupt leaders preach to and obtain support from people who cannot think for themselves.  Who know only what their emotions tell them. 

If Trump is an honest man, then Big_Sarge is challenged to prove it.  Show us all this voter fraud.  If true, then Big_Sarge will demonstrate hundreds of thousands of fraudulent votes.  If not, he is lying.  Trump says the election was stolen. If Trump is an honest man, then he did what any honest person always does.  Also say why.  If 'why' cannot be stated, then every patriotic American expresses open contempt for that potential dictator.

If Trump was an honest man, then Big_Sarge will post those facts.  When Big_Sarge cannot, then an honest man will openly apologize to the The Cellar for manipulation by a proverbial liar.

Benchmark: demonstrate honesty that is out of characte in far out extremists.  Show us these facts.  Or be honest; admit that Trump was fraudulent. Not the election.  And that his lies were mistakenly believed.  Either put up those facts or admit to believing dishonesty.

Trump lies constantly because adults, who are still children, love a bully and a liar.  Some adults are adult.  Other adults are still children - are easily brainwashed by a tirade of lies.  Show us those hundreds of thousands of fraudulent votes.  A challenge that only an honest persion can accept.

BBC says Trump has lied over 20,000 times in the past four year.  Voter fraud is just one more lie.  Only a far right extremist would admire Trump for lying.  Show us these hundreds of thousands of fradulent votes.  Or admit to lies.
 

Last edited by tw (11/08/2020 8:42 am)

Gentlemen, would you carry on like this in a coffee shop? I hope not. Disagree by all means, but please keep it civil. Stick to facts and opinions on those facts, no personal attacks or misattribution/misinterpretation of each other, eh?

Limey wrote:

Gentlemen, would you carry on like this in a coffee shop?

Hell no, in a real coffee shop there would be broken crockery and overturned things, maybe a couple bullet hole in the ceiling. That's why the furniture is bolted down. Guy Fawkes was an amateur.   
 

Thanks monster and griff. A reasoned dialogue between tw and Sarge (neither of whose views I wholeheartedly agree with) would enrich the Cellar. Indeed, it is this meeting of people that would not normally share the same space which is the essence of the Cellar in my view.
Perhaps we should all take a moment to reread the rules?

Undertoad wrote:

  tw claimed that Comcast was subverting voice packets.  

IEEE Spectrum cited the company that made that software.  Noted who (including Comcast) bought it.  FCC confirmed it and filed some kind of complaint (I forget exactly what they did.).  Apparently Comcast suddenly (and without any admission) stopped using that software.  Symptoms, that appeared intermittently on their network, suddenly stopped..

Problems, that that software was designed to create, no longer exist.

Included were reasons why. That is the point here.  I did not just make an accusation.  Included were reasons why, what that software was designed to do, (the company name also included as I recall), who was known to have purchased it (and why), its symptoms, and that the FCC took action (which I no longer remember).  Those problems with corrupted Skype packets stopped happening after those events.

UT we can fight about the irrelevant for more decades.  Or discuss only the relevant point here.  Adults include reasons why (with perspective).  Adults, who are still children, automatically know what to believe without even asking for or including those underlying facts.  Even automatically believe what their political biases (liberal or conservative) order them to believe.

That mistake is why so many even believed Saddam had WMDs.  Why the Challenger was an accident (when not one engineer could be found to say it was safe).  Missing facts even resulted in the useless death of 50,000 Americans in Nam for no purpose.  Fact we later learned when those withheld facts were leaked to every major newspaper in the country.  They all published those intentionally withheld facts on their front pages so that the president no longer obstruct the truth.

Vietnam is another example of why people die when underlying facts and numbers are withheld.

Facts also said Desert Storm was necessary (and why George Sr said, "This will not stand." after Margret Thatcher said same.).  Why a 2007 almost great depression happened.  And was averted.  Why 'so called' tax cuts eventually create economic distress.  And what makes economic growth.  In every case, each topic always needed (in long posts) reasons why.

Also says why some who only post tweets must be lying.  Maybe even to themselves.  But then, after four years, everyone should know that.  That being the point.