Offline
1) Does it exist?
2) Does it improve society, or make it worse?
3) Should you say something when you see it happening?
--a) what would happen if you did..?
--b) what would happen if you didn't..?
Last edited by Flint (11/25/2020 2:27 pm)
Offline
what would happen if you did..?
sumthin'
what would happen if you didn't..?
nuthin'
my advice: if it ain't about you, then it ain't about you, so: mind your own business, keep your hands to yourself, or else
concrete example: you overhear a fella bark to his woman, bitch, get that fat ass over here...you might wanna keep rollin', jack
now: if that fella starts wallopin' on his fat ass bitch, well, that's a different tale...as I reckon it, he done crossed the line...me, I'd be obliged to intervene...not to have a conversation about his soul but to stop him from treatin' her like a side of beef in a Rocky movie
I might very well get my testicles handed to me for my trouble , but them's the breaks
see: *my ethic only says a person belongs to himself so it's wrong to treat him as property or resource...and I'm talkin' physically here...I got no obligation to get into people's heads and scrub away at their psyches...my obligation -- to myself, to others -- is respectin' people's ownness, and defendin' mine and the other guy's where I must and can
their souls: that's god's sphere, and he's welcome to it
*in full...
a man belongs to himself
his life, liberty, and property are his
his life, liberty, or property is only forfeit, in part or whole, when he knowingly, willingly, without just cause, deprives another, in part or whole, of life, liberty, or property
Last edited by henry_quirk (11/25/2020 5:30 pm)
Offline
If your best friend left a restaurant without paying, and you didn't know whether they did it on purpose, or accidentally, would you say something to them about it?
Remember, you wouldn't be making a moral judgement-- because it could have been an honest mistake. But there is a chance that you could offend them, if they skipped the bill on purpose, and therefore think you are deeming their purposeful actions to be immoral.
Would you simply mention it to them, point it out in a neutral fashion?
Or would you be violating their sovereignty by saying anything at all?
Offline
If your best friend left a restaurant without paying, and you didn't know whether they did it on purpose, or accidentally, would you say something to them about it?
am I gettin' stuck with the bill?
Last edited by henry_quirk (11/25/2020 5:58 pm)
Offline
There is no financial impact to you in either version of events.
Offline
so: my buddy is rippin' off -- intentionally or not -- someone he contracted with (they fed him predicated on his payin' for the meal)
yeah, I'll say pay your bill
Offline
Interesting, that's not what I thought you were going to say.
Tell me if this sounds fair, or if I am off the mark-- I think that you think your intervention (verbal) would be warranted based on your assessment that you have witnessed actions by one individual that could have an impact on another individual. Specifically, the violation of an implied contract.
Offline
Flint wrote:
Interesting, that's not what I thought you were going to say.
Tell me if this sounds fair, or if I am off the mark-- I think that you think your intervention (verbal) would be warranted based on your assessment that you have witnessed actions by one individual that could have an impact on another individual. Specifically, the violation of an implied contract.
it was theft...contract violations usually are
Offline
And what is the basis of your right to intervene in this situation?
You're not a law enforcement officer, it isn't your job to interfere with a theft being committed.
Offline
Flint wrote:
And what is the basis of your right to intervene in this situation?
You're not a law enforcement officer, it isn't your job to interfere with a theft being committed.
look upthread...there's an edit you missed
Offline
I did miss that. You mean this part?
his life, liberty, or property is only forfeit, in part or whole, when he knowingly, willingly, without just cause, deprives another, in part or whole, of life, liberty, or property
Offline
Flint wrote:
I did miss that. You mean this part?
his life, liberty, or property is only forfeit, in part or whole, when he knowingly, willingly, without just cause, deprives another, in part or whole, of life, liberty, or property
I mean all of it...
a man belongs to himself
his life, liberty, and property are his
his life, liberty, or property is only forfeit, in part or whole, when he knowingly, willingly, without just cause, deprives another, in part or whole, of life, liberty, or property
this is my natural rights libertarianism...a kind of moral realism, not an ideology or politics
Offline
Would chopping someone's leg off be a deprivation of life? Or liberty?
Or, in the weirdest possible interpretation, property?
Offline
c: weird
but I hasten to add this is the kind of conversation I missed while you were gone hq.
Offline
I disagree with henry on some of what seems like big things, I suspect we agree on more things than we disagree on, when you remove the window dressing, but most of all I appreciate that he can hold a line of conversation without flaming out.
Offline
Flint wrote:
Would chopping someone's leg off be a deprivation of life? Or liberty?
Or, in the weirdest possible interpretation, property?
are we savin' a life by takin' off a diseased limb, has permission been gotten?
or: are we talkin' about an attack wherein the attacker wants that leg?
Offline
BigV wrote:
c: weird
but I hasten to add this is the kind of conversation I missed while you were gone hq.
what's weird?
you belong to you, yeah?
Offline
Flint wrote:
I disagree with henry on some of what seems like big things, I suspect we agree on more things than we disagree on, when you remove the window dressing, but most of all I appreciate that he can hold a line of conversation without flaming out.
I think there's an insurmountable gulf between us (well, between me and almost everyone here)
as for havin' a conniption: what's the point? if I get fed up, I walk away
Offline
henry, I think there's an insurmountable gulf between what I actually think and what my values are and the straw man // boogey man that you keep projecting at me out of left field. No matter how many times you think I or anyone whats to "cOnTrOL pEoPLe'S tHoUgHts" that will never, ever be anything but the little story you tell yourself in your own head. Say it and think it a million times, write it down and put it under your pillow for the tooth fairy, it doesn't serve any function but to dehumanize people you probably don't even disagree with, if you could just get past that mental block.
Offline
Flint wrote:
henry, I think there's an insurmountable gulf between what I actually think and what my values are and the straw man // boogey man that you keep projecting at me out of left field. No matter how many times you think I or anyone whats to "cOnTrOL pEoPLe'S tHoUgHts" that will never, ever be anything but the little story you tell yourself in your own head. Say it and think it a million times, write it down and put it under your pillow for the tooth fairy, it doesn't serve any function but to dehumanize people you probably don't even disagree with, if you could just get past that mental block.
what?
I'm confused, did I miss sumthin'?
Offline
And just when you thought is couldn't get stranger too. Ha Ha Ha
Last edited by xoxoxoBruce (11/27/2020 11:10 pm)
Offline
Anyway I'm generally curious if chopping someone's leg off would be a deprivation of life, liberty, or property.
I mean-- which one is it, and if none of the above, it's cool to chop people's legs off?
Last edited by Flint (11/27/2020 11:34 pm)
Offline
Why the fuck do you think something is ok if not depriving someone of life, liberty, or property?
Offline
Flint wrote:
Anyway I'm generally curious if chopping someone's leg off would be a deprivation of life, liberty, or property.
I mean-- which one is it, and if none of the above, it's cool to chop people's legs off?
details, guy, where the devil lives...gimme
Offline
xoxoxoBruce wrote:
Why the fuck do you think something is ok if not depriving someone of life, liberty, or property?
not sayin' what you do is ok...am sayin' it ain't nobody's business what you do if you ain't deprivin' any of them of what's theirs